Shackleton WR963

[Blue_2]

Best get south for a look-see then!

[Richw_82]

Don't get hasty chaps! The prop hasn't arrived on site yet, so until it does I'm not counting my free range KFC.

However, if you want to hear the Griffons roaring, we'll be running on the following dates:

14th April - SPT "Friends of WR963" meeting
21st April - 206 Sqn reunion


Regards,

Rich

[Richw_82]

1 Apr

Coolant tank chaos...

The object of today was to replace the coolant header tank on No 4 engine, due to the corrosion found on its base. It looked a fairly simple job and should have been, but some things just like to fight.

Once the coolant was drained, the first problem was the pipe off the bottom. A vintage 1971 rubber hose, it soon was off after being cut along its length. The cork anti chafing strips had stuck to the tank, and the retaining straps, taking a hell of an effort to separate them!

Once we had the tank off, the new tank was unwrapped and it was discovered that it was basically a bare tank, so the fittings have to be swapped over. Thats when the real fun started...

The corrosion inside the tank meant that the fittings were extremely reluctant to come off. So reluctant that the tank is now off site with an engineering company to get them separated without damage, and make sure that they are good for re-use.

The only thing that did come off was the header tank relief valve... and it uncovered a real horror. Crystalised coolant, and sealant all gumming up the valve, to the point it didn't seem to seat or operate properly. This is probably the reasons for the small amount of venting often seen from this particular engine.

While we have done coolant changes, the relief valve doesn't really have any flow through it, as it is fed from an internal stack pipe above the coolant level... so we're going to have to pull the others off one at a time and make sure that they are not gummed up the same.

A small amount of other work was done around the aircraft which saw the plug change finished, and some prep work for the mainwheels, but the coolant tank pretty much killed the days effort off.

Big thanks to the gent from the Vampire WZ507 team that rolled up his sleeves and pitched in to help with the Shackleton even though just visiting Airbase!


Regards,

Rich

[Xplumberlives]

One thing often leads to another!

Keep you chins up Rich and Team!

[Richw_82]

Its the battle we face whenever we're doing this. In service she would have been fussed over day in day out, where we can only spare a few hours each weekend.

To be honest though, I'd rather find stuff like this now, rather than discover it later - for example if it caused some problem during a run.

Rich

Edit:

Photos of the tank and the relief valve.

[Xplumberlives]

Blimey, that is a bit bunged up!

[Richw_82]

Engine run tomorrow chaps - mainly for the "Friends of WR963" but also for the delight and enjoyment of anyone else that happens to be about. We'll find out rather quickly how these new plugs do. Fingers crossed for no more misfires.

Regards,

Rich

[Xplumberlives]

Good luck, hope the weather holds for you!

[Sploosher]

thanks for the update Rich...........

hope it all goes well for the engine run........

[Kermit]

Absolute corker of a day ! Great to finally meet Rich and the aptly named Growler was a delight ! Brilliant aircraft, great engine run, I ll leave Rich to expand on that ! Did think she d start rolling, at one point which would have been a bit akward for the fire engine sitting right in front of her nice to note that Coventry is just as cold as Wellesbourne, on a windy day......

[Richw_82]

Not a bad run today, but it highlighted that there's still a long way to go to get WR963 fighting fit - especially if we want her taxying.

The "Friends" meeting didn't show the numbers we were expecting, which took the pressure off a little, as we've done quite a bit of work since the last run. We managed to get quite a few of the visitors onboard as a result, including this forum's own memeber, Kermit! (Nice to meet you finally, Jocelyn!)

The start was fairly clean, with none of the engines requiring much persuasion, so the plug change has paid off. No 1 and 4 were sounding particularly healthy, but 3 was running a tad rough. I'm hoping the cam wear isn't raising its ugly head again - we predicted it might start to show up again after a season or so of running.

All temperatures and pressures seemed spot on, so with a a very light (by Shackleton standards) aircraft, as each engine was run up 963 started to move around a bit on her oleos. The chocks, brakes, and a tug attached to the tow bar mean that so long as we only run up one at a time, she's going nowhere.

As we shut down, No 4 engine decided to blow off, and spat a large amount of coolant and steam over the top of the cowling which worried the fire crew slightly. It meant a cleaning task, and refilling when it cooled.. and it made me a little grumpy! On the positive side of things it seems to have cleared any air that was trapped in the system.

So - a little bit of tinkering to improve things, then we try again for the 206 Sqn reunion next weekend.

Kind regards,

Rich

[Sploosher]

glad to see that all went realtively well today Rich..........

hopefully 963 will be up and running down the runway this year then..........

that will be definately be a day out for me........

[Blue_2]

These old machines always throw something at you just to keep you on your toes, don't they...!

[Xplumberlives]

Nice to see you have your own way of adapted radiator bleeding!

[Richw_82]

These old machines always throw something at you just to keep you on your toes, don't they...!

Stage fright. 206Sqn are having their reunion at Coventry on Saturday 21st. Its either being parked close to the Nimrod is giving WR963 the heebie jeebies (or maybe she's caught a gremlin off it?) Either way I'm hiding the diary from now on.

No show stopping issues though, at least the coolant blow off valve isn't blocked any more!

Rich

[Blue_2]

Its either being parked close to the Nimrod is giving WR963 the heebie jeebies (or maybe she's caught a gremlin off it?)

Entirely plausible!

[Richw_82]

21 April

Today was a good day. The 206 Sqn Association had a reunion/meeting at Coventry, and had requested WR963 be made a available for inspection, and to run later in the day.

Things kicked off early for us, with coolant replenishment needed on No 4 after it vented last week. When coolant vents though it takes quite an amount out of the system, so we would have to watch things carefully this run. We also had the ritual of preoiling to do, which involves pulling the Griffons through a few revolutions by hand with the oil pumps running.

At 10am the gates opened, and 206 Sqn members of all generations flooded in, making a beeline for the Shackleton. I don't think any one of them failed to get over the mainspars which was great - at one point I looked out of the co-pilots window to see an abandoned wheelchair and a couple of walking sticks!!

Inside the aircraft the stories started coming thick and fast. Tales of Gibraltar, Ballykelly, Singapore, the Beira patrols... and with such humour. Several old crews were reunited, and it was great to see it and be part of it. We are hoping to gt some copies of logbook entries from the people we met who had flown WR963!

At 1.30pm, we had every seat on the aircraft full, and we started the engines. 1, 3 and 4 were all fairly well behaved. No 2 is still awaiting its turn to join in. No 4 started to run a little hot, so rather than give it the chance to blow off and cause yet another air lock, it was throttled right back to idle, and the temperature settled back. Topping up the coolant again next week should eliminate the last bit of a problem here.

We ran WR963 for just over half an hour, and had to open the rear door twice to let some people off and others in. All that wanted to had a taste of being on board what is currently the worlds only live Shack. For some it was the first time since the 1960's.

To add to the delight of all present; the cafe was serving "Honkers Stew", done to a traditional RAF recipe. It went down a treat, depsite the mars bar, coffee, peaches and lord knows what else went in it ...

It was brilliant to be able to give the 206 guys a great day. They are intending to come back, and were very complimentary of our work so far. We even recieved a rare and valuable gift from one gent - WR963 now has an astrocompass.

The next ground run is going to be in May.

Kind regards

Rich

[Xplumberlives]

Cracking day by all accounts, well done Rich and Team!

[Richw_82]

Other news...

As you've probably guessed the mainwheel change has been pushed back slightly. Other aircraft needed the hangar space urgently, and we weren't going to cause a fuss over it.

We are hoping to get some copies of logbook entries from the people we have met and spoke to who have flown WR963, as we've bumped into quite a few of her former crews of late. We've been looking at her movement cards and figure now is a good a time as any to start collating her story.


I've also been wading through the archive again.

I have started to try and get the definitive record of the various attempts to fly the Shackleton in preservation (Atlantique, SPT, ACSET, Heli-med of Cyprus), and I'll be posting some of the correspondence found shortly. There's far to much myth and 'maybe' out there.... I think its time to put things straight.

So the story starts here -

In late May 1991, British Aerospace were made aware that the Avro Shackletons of 8 Sqn RAF were to be disposed of by auction. They wrote two letters regarding the state of the aircraft - one to the MOD, and one to the CAA. It outlined their company position over the continued operation of the aircraft in private ownership.

These letters form the beginning of why a Shackleton has yet to fly in preservation in the UK.

Here is the letter British Aerospace wrote to the CAA.





Kind regards

Rich

[Xplumberlives]

It will be interesting to see some of this information, thanks Rich!

[Richw_82]

Keep your fingers crossed ladies and gents, but it appears we may have found a front turret.

[Xplumberlives]

Keep your fingers crossed ladies and gents, but it appears we may have found a front turret.

Fingers, arms, legs and eyes crossed, GOOD luck Mate!

[Jet Morgan]

Keep your fingers crossed ladies and gents, but it appears we may have found a front turret.

Excellent news!!!

[MOD]

Rich with your insight into the background, via your archive, do you think that BAe were being entirely reasonable in twisting the CAA's arm over whether or not they should be declaring that the Shacks were not suitable for flight?

I know is is easy to see all sorts of conspiracy theories but in your opinion were Mr Scott-Wilson's fears justified?

(BTW thanks again for the updates) Your Mum didn't have to make the 'Honker's Stew' did she?? Sounds a bit gross>>>>

Ian

[Richw_82]

I think they were being reasonable in some respects but not in others. I think had the CAA been left to make their own decision, its likely they would have come up with the same answer, as the spar cracking issue that the Shackleton suffers from was originally found on the Argosy (which has a Shackleton derived wing).

The letters in the archive show that BAe were getting quite worried regarding the sale of very old aircraft into private hands. It seems a bit over the top if you just take it at face value. If you then look deeper into the reasoning, you have a 40 year old aircraft, that has flown for some 200% beyond its anticipated service life. At the end it was being checked on a regular basis by BAe specialist NDT teams to be sure it was fit to fly. Removal of this service meant the aircraft couldn't be approved to fly - for the RAF or anyone else.

In private ownership, the aircraft then had two ways to get a permit to fly. One was that the inspections would continue and be approved by the CAA as adequate. This would give the aircraft another brief life before you would be starting to find the cracks appearing that the inspections look for.

The second would be a respar (including replacement of other life expired items). Although more expensive, it would give the aircraft another long period of usage, much as has been done for PA474.

I think all in all, the letter was justified. Here's a letter from BAe to the MOD. As you'll see, this defines things a little more.





Regards

Rich


ps.

The "honkers stew" was made, I think about 10 litres of it in all. It was actually quite tasty! Those old aircrew knew what they were doing.

Pictures have arrived of the turret. It definitely says Boulton Paul Type N. Can't post any for now, or say where it is for the obvious reasons.