558 to Waddington 2nd July (WARNING - HAS BECOME ADULT!)

[Wedgy]

Im so angry I cannot keep my mouth shut ... managed to shut up before entering 'rant' mode

http://www.vulcantothesky.org/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6704

[Jigsaw]

F*&K IT. Not sure I fancy a 2 1/2 hour drive to Waddo now

[Dangerousdave]

How many people will be demanding their money back at Waddo today? How many have gone JUST to see her fly? The MANAGEMENT knew yesterday that they had a BIG problem so why did they only update Twitter an hour ago when most people have set off already JUST to see a plane fly that is grounded. People are struggling to pay for petrol in their cars, they are paying serious money for airshow tickets, they are dragging their families out for a day, they are queing in traffic jams, they are speding loads of money at an airshow JUST to see 558 and the management have behave as dishonestly as ANY politician.

THE MANAGEMENT KNEW, THEY BLOODY KNEW.

THEY ARE DECEITFUL, DISHONEST AND SECRETIVE.
WE PAY THEIR WAGES AND FOR THEIR POSH HOTELS LET'S SACK THE F******G LOT OF THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Nickolas]

morning all, I smelt a rat yesterday when Damien announced where she is going to be parked.

Any vestige of street cred has finally evaporated in my opinion.

Pleming and Edmonson must GO.

[Hungry Haggis]

OK folks can someone fill me in .Not on TVOC anymore BUT was about to leave for the airport for private flight down to see 558 do her stuff for the first time and this thread is telling me in various ways she has been grounded, Seriously WTF is going on .And please don't tell me TVOC managment have screwd up again and let down not only the crowds but their own ground crew ,In anticipation I will say this they are a right bunch of (insert any strong rude word you wish).

[Wedgy]

"Administration Glitch" apparently

f*** off! - SOMEONE COCKED UP!!!!

[Dangerousdave]

Someone forgot about the permit to fly!

[Hungry Haggis]

Someone forgot about the permit to fly!

HAHAHA Now thats not funny is almost akin to forgetting to put petrol in your car and expecting it to go .Has anyone got a convenient wall that would stop some bullets Hollow point ones .The management team require changing with immediate effect.

[Dangerousdave]

Yeah. I mentioned that on the 'other side' forum and got a telling off from a moderator

[Hungry Haggis]

Yeah. I mentioned that on the 'other side' forum and got a telling off from a moderator

I'm gona guess that the MODs here might just push their way to the front so they can have first shot

[Dangerousdave]

Apparently a courier is on the way to the airshow with a permit to fly and they are hoping to fly her today. Not confirmed though so we will have to see.

[Hungry Haggis]

does the CAA work Saturdays as well now . This should be interesting

[Dangerousdave]

Just come through from Twitter

No flying this weekend. Aircraft serviceable but conditions of renewing permit to fly have not been met as a structural inspection of XMed has not been made. We are as dissapointed as you

[Mackrick]

[Wedgy]

Said better than all of us put together

[Mackrick]

If only I could tell what I know ...

[Coastergirl]

To me, the number one concern is seeing if there is any way she could fly this weekend.. The next concern to me is 'how' has this happened? I realise I won't get any answers to this, but it helps to 'vent' lol..

Is it a case that Marshalls haven't done the testing on 603 at Woodford and that is cause for the PTF to be denied? If this is the case, then I have two further questions; why did someone in Engineering Management not check this had been done and why was the application for PTF left so late? If it had have been done sooner, the 'issue' would have been realised earlier and something could have been done about it.

OR

Is it a case that the CAA would allow an extension to the PTF even without the testing on 603, but it was not applied for early enough?

OR

Is it simply an administration error where someone forgot to put a stamp on the envelope that the PTF application was sent in?

Whatever the reason, however this has happened, it just seems unforgiveable. If this happened at Kiddiecoaster's pre-school, or our local village amateur dramatics society, then people might still be a bit annoyed but you would just think "oh well, mistakes happen, they are all volunteers". That isn't the case with the VOC; these people are getting paid a lot of money and are given a lot of responsibility. In return, they should be up to the job. Someone, somewhere, has dropped the ball recently - and there is no room for those kind of mistakes in business, especially not multi-million pound business that were just recovering from a history of bad public image.

I am not expecting any replies, I understand the points about "it is too soon to discuss, etc" but for me I can't sit quietly or it will fester. I'm not casting any aspersions on particular people and will wait for formal announcement before I comment any more.

Huge huge huge huge hugs to the volunteers at the V V today; you have a hard day ahead of you and we send you all our love and support. Thank you in advance.

CG

[Wedgy]

If only I could tell what I know ...

Must be frustrating - but no one here expects you to spill the beans, as we understand you are now have association with them

[Pujgnie]

Just posted under General News :


Vulcan displays at RAF Waddington cancelled
04 July 2009 - VTTS

The Vulcan to the Sky Trust (VTST) and Marshall Aerospace are deeply disappointed and saddened to have to announce that the planned displays of the Vulcan at the RAF Waddington International Airshow on 4th and 5th July have had to be cancelled.



As part of the 2005-7 Major servicing, a number of structural inspections had to be deferred, because it was not feasible to complete them on XH558’s airframe. It was planned by VTST and Marshal Aerospace, in agreement with BAE Systems and the Civil Aviation Authority, that these inspections would be carried out before the renewal of XH558’s Permit to Fly on 3rd July 2009, using the airframe of BAE Systems-owned Vulcan XM603 at Woodford, as part of the scrapping process of this aircraft. Unfortunately, despite best intentions, it has not yet proved possible to complete or establish mitigations for all these inspections. Consequently, we have currently not fully met the conditions that would enable the issue of XH558’s Permit to Fly renewal.



XH558 is however is fully serviceable and ready for flight, and Marshall Aerospace together with VTST and BAE Systems are doing all they can as quickly as they can to resolve this unexpected, one-off issue within the next few days. We are very sad that it is not going to be possible for the Vulcan to display at Waddington over the weekend of 4th/5th July.

[Saracenman]

pathetic cop-out!

VTS knew the expiry date of the PtoF when it was issued last year - they've had TWELVE MONTHS to sort this matter out. posting an anonymously written news release two days AFTER the expiration of the PtoF, whilst crowds have amassed at Waddo to see her fly is downright disgraceful

we, as Club members have kept our end of the bargain - VTST management have NOT!

sm

[Dangerousdave]

They knew all along that she wouldn't make it this weekend and they chose to LIE to us. Oh well, here are the details of the bloke who made the announcement:


For more information on this Press Release, please contact:

VTST - Richard Clarke:
07714 898548 / richard@rclarke7.wanadoo.co.uk

[Hungry Haggis]

God Almighty (yes SM there is a higher being )
if that came from the pathetic braain of on of the managment then they really should be lined up and shot As has been said they had 12 months or will the next bit come out that because of the Funding crisis they could not aford to carry out a test that I am thinking will destroy XM603 or have I again grabbed an angry Vulcan by the nose.It's the ground and aircrew that i am sorry for they got her to the show in excelent condition ,only now they have to sit out and do nothing during something they have worked dam hard for .Due simply to some office prats incompitance in organizing something they knew had to be done .Oh well lets hope they get it sorted before they loose even more appearance fees.

Goes back under rock in disgust.

[Flipflopman]

Now, as you know, I don't post up very much any more on the subject of 558, as to be totally honest I've had a gutful of it all. Having had a little more 'behind the scenes' experience than others, and having personally experienced the full effects of the appalingly bad 'management' on many seperate occasions, My patience has been tested to the point where I no longer have any interest in being associated with the whole debacle, however....

Having just heard and read about all of this, and especially the quite frankly ridiculous press release posted above, complete with TVOC's attempts to shrug it off as a "one off" occasion despite "best intentions" I feel that I'd quite like to vent my spleen a little and throw in my 2p worth!

There is only really one place where the buck stops here, and that is firmly at the door of the self appointed "Engineering Director" or "Engineering Manager" or whichever grandiose title he has decided to award himself this month. Unfortunately, with such a position, comes certain responsibilities and one of those is the ultimate responsibility for all engineering matters. Whether or not he chooses to delegate the matters elsewhere to people who are more suited or capable is immaterial. Ultimately, he is the end of the road and should take ultimate responsibility. The fact of the matter in this case is that the Structural Sampling tests, which have been known about for over 2 years now, have not been completed, despite the fact that the CAA have mandated that these are essential conditions of the permit being renewed, and as the Engineering Manager, ultimately, he is responsible for ensuring that the Sampling was completed in time for the renewal. Simple as that really.

The checks being discussed originally formed part of the original RAF Major servicing, which was being carried out alongside all of the Enhanced inspections and modifications XH558 recieved during her restoration. Originally, as the name suggests, the sampling checks were carried out across a percentage of the fleet, to give a broad idea of the condition of the fleet, and were not carried out on every aircraft undergoing a major. Due to this fact, and because of the depth of some of the sampling checks, which included such inaccessible items as the Fin attachment bolts for example, it was agreed during discussion with the CAA etc that the checks could be carried out on XM603 as technically she was part of the fleet, and any damage, dissasembly required would not incur the headaches it would with 558. All well and good, and required much good will from the CAA really. The conditions imposed by the CAA for this however, was that the work would be carried out prior to the next Permit application. A little like an ADF in principle. This gave TVOC a window of over a year to do this work and present the results. This work was then left incomplete and therefore, quite rightly the CAA have refused the application. What is particularly outrageous about all of this is that this has clearly been known about for a VERY long time, and has taken place through a year where for a large chunk, there has been very little for the engineers to do, and despite the protestations that will inevitably follow, that is an inescapable fact. Obviously, these are only my own opinions, but to allow this to reach the stage where we now have a grounded aircraft and a refused Permit, smacks of either incredibly incompetant engineering management, or blatent arrogance and disregard of aviation legislation and rules that are in place for everyones safety. Either way, the buck must stop somewhere, and how many times can events like this be tolerated and simply glossed over with a little "It's a one off" spin?

Sorry if you disagree with any or all of my post, but I am sat here fuming and utterly utterly disgusted on all levels, and to be totally frank, embarassed to have been associated with TVOC in any way at all.

Rant over...


Flipflopman

[Saracenman]

FFM - as always, your own involvement with 558's restoration, and the goings on at Brunty, carry enormous weight and SHOULD be taken seriously! thanks for your opinions - you are one of the few who actually know what you're on about!

personally, I'm not a 'told you so' person, but i can't disguise the fact that I've been questioning the effectiveness of VTS/TVOC management for some time - and been harangued for it by many. sadly this PtoF issue proves me right

Andrew Edmondson needs to either resign, or be sacked - simple!

sm

[Nickolas]

Smoke and mirrors................

Well we've been had over again.

Personally I want Edmonsons head on a pole.

Enough is FINALLY enough.

Thankfully for me Waddo was not on the radar this year. RIAT is though. Thousands have been duped. Don't expect much cash next time chum. This escapade is probably the final death knell for the project. NO ONE is going to get conned again.

I bet Edmondson has not got the balls to stand outside the VV for the duration and personally apologise for his F**K UP.

Disgusted of Tonbridgewells Sawbridgeworth.